Louise Gallagher and I met in the spring of 2003. She called herself Ellie, the woman with a dog she called pooch, her constant companion and comfort. Ellie became a popular poster on the NPD forum, reminding people to Show Up and Stand Up and above all: Breath. Paying attention to our breath was Ellie's signature advice to anxious newcomers and exhausted longtimers.
Ellie continued offering her support with an inspirational blog, Recover Your Joy. She has written one book titled, The Dandelion Spirit. If you're interested in reading her book, you can purchase it from her directly:
The following is a conversational interview between Ellie and myself in March of 2011. It was a true pleasure to speak with her on a more intimate basis. I hope everyone enjoys our discussion about trauma, healing, & recovery.
CZ: Hi Ellie. Could you briefly describe why you joined narcissism and psychopathy forums?
Ellie: Conrad was arrested May 21, 2003. I found my way to MSN's Narcissistic Personality Disorder forum two weeks later, desperate for answers, desperate to find a group of people who would accept me without saying, "What was the matter with you that you’d stay with such an azzhole?" By the way, I learned how to spell azzhole like that from you.
CZ: Nice to know I had a lasting impact on you. Please. Go on with your story.
Ellie: Well, in 1998, after ending a 3-year relationship with a man I truly loved but who was bipolar and waaay too difficult to be in relationship with, I met Conrad at a business meeting. He was charming, intelligent, distinguished and he promised me the world. Right from the get-go. All the classic signs of a man with a plan that did not include his promise to never hurt me. Because hurt me he did. He lied, cheated, deceived, contrived and convinced me to let go of all that I held dear, including my daughters.
By the end of that wild 4-year nine-month ride, I would lose my life-savings, my home, my job, my car, my self-esteem, my belief in the goodness of humankind and almost my life. I dreamt about death. Coveted the idea, the thought, the possibility of it. I wanted to be released from that living hell but believed him when he said, "You are nothing without me." When he fled the province in February 2003, he took me with him. It wouldn't be until May 21, 2003 that my daughters would hear from me again. They were 14 and 15 and I deserted them.
He was arrested May 21, 2003 at 9:14 am. I awoke the next day at my sister's home and examined the devastation of my life. I had 72 cents in my pocket, a few clothes and my trusty Golden Retriever, Ellie, who had gone through that living hell with me. I was broken. I was lost. I needed answers. I went to the Internet. It was there, in a forum for women and men who had been victims of psychopaths that I found my answers. I was not crazy. I was not alone. I was broken and needed to start finding the scattered pieces of my self and reclaim my identity again.
Ellie: There were a few in the beginning. I think one of the aspects that can be challenging in an online forum is its one dimensional limitations. Also, the fact that you are dealing with people who are hurting – and sometimes, because of that one dimensional aspect, the nuances are missing. There was a German woman who tended to get huffy, really quickly – and some of that was language barriers and some was her nature. Mostly though, the common denominator of – we are all here to heal and support each other – really makes a difference.
CZ: What was the most healing aspect of message boards?
Ellie: The fact that people understood without being told what I was feeling. The fact that I didn’t have to explain what he’d done – they knew. And I didn’t feel ‘less than’, or ‘other than’, or ‘stupid’. I felt part of a community where I could belong and share my sorrow and my strengths, my fears and my hopes and be heard.
Also, I knew I could get up in the middle of the night and write if I had to. And probably, for me, the most healing thing was having a safe and healing place to write, share my love of writing and my love of words. Also, I could give – I wasn't just taking. I could help someone else and that felt good.
I had, and still have, a bit of a different outlook in some ways. I didn’t want to spend a lot of time talking about ‘what he’d done. I needed to write about what happened to me and what I was doing to create more of what I wanted in my life – for those first months in particular, I knew I wasn’t strong enough to talk about him. I couldn't spend my precious energy on thinking about what he was doing or saying or thinking. I had to think and do and say about me. Being on the forum gave me the courage to keep that focus alive for me.
CZ: What blocked healthy connections to other people, then? Were there problems unique to message boards?
Ellie: I’d have to say it was learning to trust myself – to know I have boundaries in a time when they’d pretty well been destroyed. I remember when someone ‘new’ appeared, there was always that trigger---"are they real or just trolling?" And then, there were those petty infighting incidences. The people judging me because they thought I was 'whatever they thought I was' or the misunderstandings that turned into mud-slinging.
CZ: We could talk at great length about our early experiences on message boards. Suffering people are defensive. We are defensive for good reason--most people are still IN the pathological relationship. Unfortunately, this vigilance closes our hearts to 'safe' others, too.
Ellie: I must admit that I learned a lot about taking the high road, about not engaging in bad behavior, about not letting myself fall into the trap of taking it all personally. Great lessons.
CZ: Hard-WoN lessons, maybe? Anxiety runs high on recovery forums. If moderators are too 'fresh' in their recovery, the whole place ignites in a single afternoon! As a group, we're educating ourselves about pathology and at the same time, filtering our perceptions through defensive lenses. Which leads me to the next question: Was psychology literature useful in understanding 'your' reactions? How important was it to learn about pathology?
Ellie: To put it in context, my favourite magazine at age 13 was Psychology Today. Yeah, it’s important. I believe for me, understanding pathological relationships was vital. I needed to understand what happened to me. The science helped me accept that I was not ‘wrong’, I was a victim. And then to choose to be a victor not a victim. Psychology also helped me understand the pitfalls on the healing path. I still believe knowing myself can only happen when I am willing to be vulnerable within myself. Self-discovery is the greatest and most profound journey I will ever take! Understanding human nature gives me insights into myself.
CZ: People desire self-knowledge after learning about pathology. And today, we have a bibliotherapeutic market informing the public about pathology, recovery and self-discovery. Which books were the most useful, in your estimation?
Ellie: I read whatever I could get my hands on but… a few that stand out:
The Gift of Fear by Gavin de Becker, a fabulous read I had resisted reading before the NP relationship. Once I read it, I gave it to my eldest daughter who insisted her sister read it and then, we went out and bought several copies to give to their friends.
Love is Letting go of Fear by Jerald Jampolsky was the first book I read after he was arrested. Helped me move into a forgiving state of mind so that I could forgive myself – and accept my daughters forgiveness – so that we could heal and grow stronger.
Without Conscience by Dr. Robert Hare, probably the fact he was conned helped me feel less stupid! I found his descriptors and his stories very healing.
The Sociopath Next Door by Martha Stout was my bible for the longest time.
CZ: What did you find to be more helpful: professional books by people in the psyche field or personal narratives written by ordinary folks? That may be a leading question since you've written a book titled, "The Dandelion Spirit". Still, readers might want to know if the benefit you received from other people's narratives, inspired you to contribute your own.
Ellie: I found both very helpful. Professional books gave me evidence, personal narratives gave me context.
Hmmm...your next question about why I wrote my first book. Well, The Dandelion Spirit was more of a, "okay so I have this story that is rather bizarre and out there and I need to do something with it" thought. I am a writer, writers write best what they know, and I knew how to heal from a sociopathic relationship. I did not want to write the first half, the here's-what-happened part. But, to put my healing in context, I had to tell the story of how I fell and how far I fell and what happened to cause me to fall and become so blind to my own light. So, I told the first part and cried as I wrote the entire thing.
CZ: You cried as you wrote because writing makes our story real. Writing allows us to grieve, perhaps. It's easy to fool ourselves with little self-deceptions if we don't take notes. You know, Ellie, "Standing up for yourself" is an exercise in faith, because we're ashamed. We must believe we're worthy of our efforts even when we feel as though we aren't. Was there a pivotal moment when you realized in body, mind and spirit, that you were a WoNderful Woman of Worth?
Ellie: Truth is, I never really knew how I felt as me until after my healing journey. I mean, I always knew I was a Divine child of God, of a greater power, of the Creator, but I never really believed it. For me, that journey through hell was all about coming up against the lie that had lived within me since I was a child and been abused by my uncle – that "I am unworthy belief" I didn’t know was at the core of my angst. Conrad was my teacher. In many ways, one of the greatest teachers I ever had to bring me to this place where I embrace myself in all my beauty, warts and all, and know: I am a WoNderful Woman of Worth!
Those first six months were pretty tenuous. I knew I had received a miracle the day he was arrested and I knew I had been given a gift to live this one wild and precious life fearlessly in love with all of me. But, I was scared and frightened and still raw from the trauma. I’d have to say the feeling like myself is long ago. I feel like a new woman. Far stronger, greater, wiser, more confident and complete than I ever felt before.
CZ: I love hearing that, Ellie! I love knowing the New You is more vital and alive than ever before. Did you seek professional therapy to help you cope?
Ellie: I found a therapist right away. It took me four or five months before I even cried in front of her! I was determined not to ‘give in’ to whining. LOL – I had to whine. I had to go through the anger. I had to go through the sorrow and pain and hurt and disbelief and fear to get to peace. I just didn't want to do it in a way that was messy.
I didn’t try any particular treatment. I wrote. Constantly. And I committed to staying honest with myself. Probably the greatest gift I gave myself was going through Choices Seminars in April 2006 and then, Super Choices in 2008 and also coaching. Getting my Coaches certificate, working at a homeless shelter, giving back, all of that played a far greater role than any therapy.
CZ: Did your sociopathic relationship change your life in such a way that you have chosen to be an advocate for the homeless, those without voice?
Ellie: Absolutely.
I believe I am a far more compassionate and empathetic human being because of that relationship. I also believe that it is our shame that keeps us stuck in the sorrow and tragedy of the past. We tell ourselves, "It’s all my fault. I should have known better. I should have…" And then we hold ourselves pinioned to their wrong-doing.
My relationship with Conrad was never about Conrad. It was all about me.
And, what he did was never about me, ever. It was, and always will be, all about him.
At the shelter, there are thousands of individuals who come through our doors every year who believe, "this is the best I can do. Here is where I belong. This place called, being homeless, is all I deserve." And that’s where I call, bullsheet! Because those are the stories we tell ourselves to justify where we’re at. No one deserves to be abused. No one deserves to live on the street; but, because we and society have this belief system that says, "well, you asked for it, you deserve it," we keep people in their places. We keep them believing, "there’s nowhere else for me to go, nothing else I can do."
My relationship with Conrad was never about Conrad. It was all about me.
And, what he did was never about me, ever. It was, and always will be, all about him.
At the shelter, there are thousands of individuals who come through our doors every year who believe, "this is the best I can do. Here is where I belong. This place called, being homeless, is all I deserve." And that’s where I call, bullsheet! Because those are the stories we tell ourselves to justify where we’re at. No one deserves to be abused. No one deserves to live on the street; but, because we and society have this belief system that says, "well, you asked for it, you deserve it," we keep people in their places. We keep them believing, "there’s nowhere else for me to go, nothing else I can do."
For me, it was realizing my own power through that relationship that convinced me I had to help others realize theirs by advocating on their behalf and teaching them how to advocate for themselves. Throughout that relationship, I lost my voice. I found it and want to use it to inspire others to find theirs.
CZ: So you're a fairy spreading pixie dust on people, inspiring them to believe in themselves? Our world could use an injection of compassion, nurturing, caring, caretaking, soothing and comforting one another's pain. Traditionally female traits, each of those. Do you struggle letting your feminine nature shine? And might I ask---do you have any resistance to being called a fairy?
And absolutely – I struggled with letting my female traits be embodied in my true persona through everything I do and say. I remember when my eldest daughter was about ten and somebody said, “She runs like a girl.” I was taken aback – why wouldn’t she run like a girl? She is a girl? It was one of those seminal moments for me. I am a woman. Why wouldn’t I want to shine as a woman?
One of my strengths at the shelter is the fact that I am empathetic. I also know I cannot own any one else’s pain. I am not powerful enough to change their lives. I do not have the strength to carry their burdens. Nobody does. So I embody my ‘feminine’ traits of being supportive and kind and caring without submerging myself in the pain they are experiencing. I think it’s another gift from that experience – I know who I am. I don’t need anyone to approve of who I am.
I do need to approve of who I am. The best way to do that is to be true to who I am and not try to be someone else – like a man, for example.
Ellie: Ah yes, giving myself medicine. Well, my wings start drooping when I start trying to lift other people’s loads. But what keeps me going?
I coach at Choices as often as I can. Being in a room where love truly is tangible in the air; where I know, without a doubt that I am absolutely accepted the way I am, and loved the way I am is sustaining.
I also believe giving is receiving. So working at the shelter fills me up. I teach self-esteem courses at the shelter as often as I can. It lifts me up to see people excited about opening up. I take long walks with my dog as often as I can. I read and I write poetry. I listen to music that soothes me. I dance – I love to dance. I meditate, every day, and go to a group meditation once a week.
I surround myself with people who are positive, supportive and kind. I have ended some not so fulfilling relationships which was a big thing for me – it’s the realization that my integrity is more important than staying ‘friends’ with someone I don’t enjoy spending time with – and it’s far more honest to end a relationship that doesn’t work than to pretend it does.
I write. Journal every night. Read books that lift me up. Watch Ted.com talks. I’m a junky. I keep myself open to expansion and in those moments where I feel myself constricting, I remind myself to BREATHE and open up to expansion.
CZ: You sound WoNderful, Louise! You have truly moved forward, in a positive way, with your life. Still, you are writing about recovery. Why is that?
Ellie: It’s important. I have a gift – like you – of writing. And, gifts are meant to be shared. My personal contract and purpose statement is: I am a radiant woman igniting joy in an enlightened world.
I can’t live my purpose if I am not sharing my wisdom and knowledge about what I know to be true for me. I can’t ignite joy if I am hiding myself in the shadows of my fear – what will people think? Or if I listen to those tapes that riddle my brain with self-censure. You know, those tapes that go, "people will think you’re conceited. They’re gonna think you think you’re better than them."
I believe we all have a light and it’s far better to share it, than to dim it. It’s a dark, dark world if we all dim our light – so, my belief is that for people like you and me who have found their light and are walking on that brilliant path of self-enlightenment, we have no other choice than to share it. It’s so bright we can’t be missed!
CZ: Enlightenment. Everybody says they want it but do they know the price they'll pay to get it? Like having your foundations ripped out from beneath your feet; your beliefs shattered; the comfort of your certainty dissipating like ice cubes in a cup of hot coffee. It is a treacherous time and must be respected as such because each of us has varying degrees of resiliency. People react differently to stress. Speaking of stress, most people have heard of the Fight-or-Flight syndrome. There's a third option to stress that women in particular are drawn towards: Tending and Befriending. It's probably fair to say both you and I were compelled to make connections with other women during our crisis. So how important is woman-to-woman support in your life now?
Ellie: My women friends are absolutely vital. I love having women I admire in my life. Women like you – someone who is smart and witty and brilliant. I believe we attract women who reflect who we are … so, I figure if you and I are friends it’s because we see each other’s light and love the brilliance we both create separately and apart and the incredible power of our light together is something I truly cherish.
My women friends, especially those who have been on a journey and are sharing their wisdom, expand my knowing. They illuminate those areas of me where I still don’t see clearly through the film of my disbelief or denial or confusion.
My women friends are the one’s who remind me to ‘get real’, to stay the course, to not opt out of tough situations, to look for the lessons and embrace the learning. My women friends are my most loving teachers. They remind me to ‘Have Fun!’ which is something I often forget!!! And, they treat me with the care and respect I deserve, the care and respect I bestow upon them as well.
CZ: Thank you, Louise. You are a very deserving recipient of The Golden Fairy Award on our new WoN Connections website. I appreciate the time you've spent speaking so candidly with me. Thank you for supporting my recovery journey.
Ellie: Thank you, CZ. You are amazing. I am so grateful to call you my friend and I'm grateful for my fairy wings, too. I think they sparkle so pretty in the light of gratitude and thanksgiving and love.
* * * * * * * * *
And that, dear readers, is Ellie, a Golden Fairy sprinkling pixie dust in cyberspace. Are you feeling inspired? Check the ground for glitter and if you see it sparkling, collect a bit for your pocket. Then share it with others.
The only rule about pixie dust is this: if you don't share it, you run out. If you do share, you'll always have enough.
If you would like to post this interview on your blog or educational website, please include the copyright and link to our website:
The WoN Connection @ wonforum.blogspot.com
©2011, WebOfNarcissism.com
